Sony A9ii versus A7rv

[Deleted Member 5003]

Since the release of the A1 i have been converted from using previous back button focussing over shutter button focussing
to a situation wherein Wide and Zone area focussing is available to again use the shutter button half way press.

When shooting in these modes and to get good results the subjects must be front and/or center to get focus(excepting when the eye focus overides in the case of BIF) and so it made a lot of sense to me to use the AEL and/or AF-ON as triggers for other shooting modes, as the shutter button half depressed focussing works fine for the Wide and Zone area modes.

 

[lodbrok]

Since the release of the A1 i have been converted from using previous back button focussing over shutter button focussing
to a situation wherein Wide and Zone area focussing is available to again use the shutter button half way press.

When shooting in these modes and to get good results the subjects must be front and/or center to get focus(excepting when the eye focus overides in the case of BIF) and so it made a lot of sense to me to use the AEL and/or AF-ON as triggers for other shooting modes, as the shutter button half depressed focussing works fine for the Wide and Zone area modes.

Sometimes when you have to act fast and wearing gloves it can be more suitable using AF W/shutter. But I have been using BBF for years now and is very comfortable with 3 different focuses set to AF - AEL and the senterbutton.
But I like to know what you have assigned to the AF and AEL?

 

[AlphaWorld]

Bear in mind that the A9II has the older, much slower, processor. It probably doesn’t have the processing power to do bird-eye-af at 20fps, even if Sony wanted to add the functionality in firmware.

On the other hand, the A9III will have the new processor, probably the extra “AI” chip, higher speed sensor, higher frame rate, and you may need to tie a brick to it to stop it taking off

I have managed to capture images which focused on a wing tip, leaving the head (and eye) less sharp, and that’s using an A1. I worked out what happened - the wingtip was over the head when the auto focus happened, but when it took the shot the head was uncovered and just a bit blurry. My fault, I guess, for shooting with the aperture wide open to get a high shutter speed. Admittedly, this was one shot in a burst of 12, and the others were good.

 

[lodbrok]

Bear in mind that the A9II has the older, much slower, processor. It probably doesn’t have the processing power to do bird-eye-af at 20fps, even if Sony wanted to add the functionality in firmware.

On the other hand, the A9III will have the new processor, probably the extra “AI” chip, higher speed sensor, higher frame rate, and you may need to tie a brick to it to stop it taking off

I have managed to capture images which focused on a wing tip, leaving the head (and eye) less sharp, and that’s using an A1. I worked out what happened - the wingtip was over the head when the auto focus happened, but when it took the shot the head was uncovered and just a bit blurry. My fault, I guess, for shooting with the aperture wide open to get a high shutter speed. Admittedly, this was one shot in a burst of 12, and the others were good.

I was thinkin like that too, that the A9ii probarly not have the power to process bird-eye. I will wait for the release of the 9iii and then trade in my 9ii. Bird-eye can be a game-changer aspecialy with remote-controlled shooting. Yust set it up with wide focus/bird-eye and a wide-angle lense on a gorillapod. And then I can shoot with the 200-600mm ca 20-30 meters away.

 

[Uncle Kevriano]

I was thinkin like that too, that the A9ii probarly not have the power to process bird-eye. I will wait for the release of the 9iii and then trade in my 9ii. Bird-eye can be a game-changer aspecialy with remote-controlled shooting. Yust set it up with wide focus/bird-eye and a wide-angle lense on a gorillapod. And then I can shoot with the 200-600mm ca 20-30 meters away.

That's cheating

 

[AlphaWorld]

That's cheating

Maybe, but the resulting images are not branded with “cheating using bird eye AF”!

Hmm, maybe you want Sony to add an entry to the metadata saying “this image was taken using bird eye AF; this photographer cheats!”?

I might not install the fiirmware update!

 

[Brownie]

Maybe, but the resulting images are not branded with “cheating using bird eye AF”!

Hmm, maybe you want Sony to add an entry to the metadata saying “this image was taken using bird eye AF; this photographer cheats!”?

I might not install the fiirmware update!

My metadata says: "This image is in focus. You clearly cheated."

 

[AlphaWorld]

My metadata says: "This image is in focus. You clearly cheated."

Hmm - I seem to have that on all my images…

 

[iamdlewis]

I am very tempted to trade in my A9ii for the A7rv. I'm mostly crop in and also want the birdeye focus! Also the manual overide when you touch the focusring.. BUT... I shoot BIF alot and read a lot that A7riv users is struggling with BIF.. Why is that? If you nail a bird in flight with 24 megapixel why can't you nail it likewize with 61mp? Anybody inhere have some opinion around this? Mark Smith says something simular with 61mp. Will I regret the switch since I love to shoot BIF? I will use it with my 200-600mm.

A7riv doesn't have a fast sensor so you would get two things with BiF, 1 you might have the bird in nearly the same position as it flies by but the AF will be just a tad behind and 2 the rolling shutter could make the birds appear weird. I went from the A9 to the A7Riv because most of the birds in my area are really skittish and the A7Riv basically gave me 50% more reach which was great for BiT (bird in tree) but BiF was not so good. With the A9 I was typically looking at 80% of the BiF shots being in focus and looking good but the A7Riv it was like 10-20%. I did find that I had better success with the 100-400 than the 200-600 with the A7Riv on larger birds, small ones like swallows was just a waste of time, but it was still nothing like the hit rate of the A9. Overall I would say that BiF with the A7Riv was a frustrating experience because I could see that it was the camera that was the issue with the misses and not something I was doing.

When you would hit with the A7Riv it was nice (not cropped).

• ILCE-7RM4
• Sony FE 100-400mm F4.5-5.6 GM OSS (SEL100400GM)
• 400.0 mm
• ƒ/5.6
• 1/2500 sec
• ISO 400

 

[AlphaWorld]

A7riv doesn't have a fast sensor so you would get two things with BiF, 1 you might have the bird in nearly the same position as it flies by but the AF will be just a tad behind and 2 the rolling shutter could make the birds appear weird. I went from the A9 to the A7Riv because most of the birds in my area are really skittish and the A7Riv basically gave me 50% more reach which was great for BiT (bird in tree) but BiF was not so good. With the A9 I was typically looking at 80% of the BiF shots being in focus and looking good but the A7Riv it was like 10-20%. I did find that I had better success with the 100-400 than the 200-600 with the A7Riv on larger birds, small ones like swallows was just a waste of time, but it was still nothing like the hit rate of the A9. Overall I would say that BiF with the A7Riv was a frustrating experience because I could see that it was the camera that was the issue with the misses and not something I was doing.

When you would hit with the A7Riv it was nice (not cropped).View attachment 31109

Rolling shutter is not normally an issue with mechanical shutter. I use the A7RIV / V as mechanical shutter cameras. The burst speed is not high, though - the stacked sensors have it all over the A7R sensors for frame rate!

 

[lodbrok]

That's cheating

Yes

 

[lodbrok]

A7riv doesn't have a fast sensor so you would get two things with BiF, 1 you might have the bird in nearly the same position as it flies by but the AF will be just a tad behind and 2 the rolling shutter could make the birds appear weird. I went from the A9 to the A7Riv because most of the birds in my area are really skittish and the A7Riv basically gave me 50% more reach which was great for BiT (bird in tree) but BiF was not so good. With the A9 I was typically looking at 80% of the BiF shots being in focus and looking good but the A7Riv it was like 10-20%. I did find that I had better success with the 100-400 than the 200-600 with the A7Riv on larger birds, small ones like swallows was just a waste of time, but it was still nothing like the hit rate of the A9. Overall I would say that BiF with the A7Riv was a frustrating experience because I could see that it was the camera that was the issue with the misses and not something I was doing.

When you would hit with the A7Riv it was nice (not cropped).View attachment 31109

Idealy if I could rented an A7rV and see if this is what I want - But there's no such service around my local photoshops. So I will wait for the A9iii and make the swop if the reviews is good. And I bet they will be good!

 

[Deleted Member 5003]

Agree entirely with iamdlewis. From my experience with the A7Riv compared against the A9ii, whilst the A7Riv was very good for still images
It fell way short on action/BIF focusing and as a BIRD SHOOTER first, led me to sell it off immediately after arrival and field testing my aA9ii.

 

[iamdlewis]

Idealy if I could rented an A7rV and see if this is what I want - But there's no such service around my local photoshops. So I will wait for the A9iii and make the swop if the reviews is good. And I bet they will be good!

Depending on the price of the A9iii (which I think will get a boost in mp to match the A7iv) you may want to consider the A1. It is the love child of the A9ii and A7Riv and I have been super happy with it.

 

[Uncle Kevriano]

Maybe, but the resulting images are not branded with “cheating using bird eye AF”!

Hmm, maybe you want Sony to add an entry to the metadata saying “this image was taken using bird eye AF; this photographer cheats!”?

I might not install the fiirmware update!

I'm joking of course, but it does kind of take away the skill of photography.

 

[Clix Pix]

I have both the A7R V and the A1 and believe me, the A1 is far superior when it comes to shooting bursts with wildlife. In 2019 I started out with the A7R IV and while I loved that camera for its great resolution and many megapixels, which is perfect for macro, I realized that it wasn't quite so great when I was trying to shoot BIF or birds moving quickly in the water. I had just started vaguely thinking about getting an A9II for the wildlife stuff when the A1 was announced, and I realized that it was the way to go. I kept the A7R IV and used it primarily for macros, closeup, tabletop photography, etc., and the A1 became the camera of choice for going out with the 100-400mm or shooting with the 200-600mm.

A couple of months ago I traded in the A7R IV for the A7R V and so far have not shot BIF or birds in the water with that camera; it's wintertime and I do a lot of macro shooting during the cold months and the A7R V is wonderful for that, just like her predecessor -- actually, better. When Spring comes, though, one day I will slip the 100-400mm on her and we'll go out for an excursion, just to put her through her paces when it comes to BIF and squirrels and other interesting things outdoors.

In your situation I would either go for an A1, available now, or wait for the A9 III to be announced and released. Either of those cameras will be more satisfactory than the A7R V for the kind of shooting you like to do.

 

[AlphaWorld]

I have both the A7R V and the A1 and believe me, the A1 is far superior when it comes to shooting bursts with wildlife. In 2019 I started out with the A7R IV and while I loved that camera for its great resolution and many megapixels, which is perfect for macro, I realized that it wasn't quite so great when I was trying to shoot BIF or birds moving quickly in the water. I had just started vaguely thinking about getting an A9II for the wildlife stuff when the A1 was announced, and I realized that it was the way to go. I kept the A7R IV and used it primarily for macros, closeup, tabletop photography, etc., and the A1 became the camera of choice for going out with the 100-400mm or shooting with the 200-600mm.

A couple of months ago I traded in the A7R IV for the A7R V and so far have not shot BIF or birds in the water with that camera; it's wintertime and I do a lot of macro shooting during the cold months and the A7R V is wonderful for that, just like her predecessor -- actually, better. When Spring comes, though, one day I will slip the 100-400mm on her and we'll go out for an excursion, just to put her through her paces when it comes to BIF and squirrels and other interesting things outdoors.

In your situation I would either go for an A1, available now, or wait for the A9 III to be announced and released. Either of those cameras will be more satisfactory than the A7R V for the kind of shooting you like to do.

The A1 is the best burst camera, no question, at least until the A9III arrives. I stopped using the A7RIV for BiF after getting the A1, but I did manage to get some good shots with the A7RIV before I got the A1. That’s why I would not rule it out for this kind of shooting, especially for someone who could not afford an A1. It’s more difficult, and the frame rate is far lower, making bursts, well, less useful. That is little changed on the A7RV, but the AF is better - the A7RV is rather good for perched birds, and I am working at getting some shots of birds leaving perch (the difficulties I am having mostly relate to aging reflexes!).

If I’m setting out to shoot BiF, then the A1 is my natural choice - that was one of the reasons I bought it. But for more general wildlife, the A7RV is worthy of consideration. And when an A1II combines the new AF with other goodies, I’m definitely in line to get one!

 

[lodbrok]

Depending on the price of the A9iii (which I think will get a boost in mp to match the A7iv) you may want to consider the A1. It is the love child of the A9ii and A7Riv and I have been super happy with it.

I'm guarding the pre-owned market in Norway for A1's.

 

[Deleted Member 5003]

Agree entirely with iamdlewis. From my experience with the A7Riv compared against the A9ii, whilst the A7Riv was very good for still images
It fell way short on action/BIF focusing and as a BIRD SHOOTER first, led me to sell it off immediately after arrival and field testing my aA9ii.