Should I get an A1?

[-ST-]

Hi, Jeff.

There are so many good responses to this thread, I won't attempt to modify the responses. I just want to address one of your statements. You said "nobody compares those two bodies". I actually read a response from a well known photographer-Educator, Mark Galer. He has been a Sony Ambassador for over 10 years and recently on his Q&A Forum, he did answer that question. Comparing the A7IV, the A7RV and the A1 in Auto focus performance, he didn't hesitate. Absolutely the A1. It's all about the stacked sensor. Now, the A1 is missing some of the latest bells and whistles but when you get down to pure performance, the A1 wins.

Thanks for this. I must have missed or forgotten this comparison from Mark Galer. I've spent a lot of time with his video tutorials, comparisons and reviews.

I suspect that within a year, the A1 will incorporate these new improvements, but I have no information to back this up. One other thing, about lenses, and again about Mark Galer. The longest lens he normally shoots with (Other than testing) is the 100-400 GM and although he has tested the 1.4 & 2.0 TC, he does just fine without them. He does own a 200-600 but he feels it's too much to carry. Don't forget the light loss with the TC's.T

Thanks for that reminder. I was only considering the teleconverter with the 70-200 GM II. Given that the effective aperture at 400 mm (f 5.6) is the same as with the 100-400, the lighter weight, internal zoom, newer motors, and the flexibility to shoot at f2.8 without the teleconverter, shorter minimum focal distance - the 70-200 GM II with the option to use the 2x teleconverter looked like the better combination for me. I'm pretty sure I got most of those insights from Mark Galer.

Just for grins, go to Flickr.com and look at Mark Galer's albums and how they are organized and you will have all the info you need, right there.

I'll check him out on Flickr.

Good luck in your quest. If I had your resources, I would just wait for the A1-II, but that is just me.

If I can pick up a 2x teleconverter, I'll get the 70-200 GM II again. If that happens, I may be happily pre-occupied enough to wait for the A1 II.

Thanks for your thoughts and ideas.

 

[evacguy]

Hi, Jeff.

If I can pick up a 2x teleconverter, I'll get the 70-200 GM II again. If that happens, I may be happily pre-occupied enough to wait for the A1 II.

Thanks for your thoughts and ideas.

ST, have you thought of purchasing the ST from elsewhere i.e., outside of your region? You may have to pay import duty, but I'm guessing it won't be too much. I was about to purchase a 2x TC a few months ago in the UK but changed my mind in the end, so I'm guessing its still available here.

 

[Landshark99]

wow, quite a discussion going on here. All I have to add is I have both an A1 and an A7RV, love both, I do carry both camera many times when I shoot, or at least have both with me. I know I am supposed to say that after my 45+ years as a professional photographer ( shooting with a vast number of different camera sytems) that one should not chase the gear but instead chase the experience first. Well I actually think if you have the funds buy the best you can for the use you intend it for. The hard part sometimes is really deciding what is that use, is it wildlife, specifically birds or is it landscapes, portraits, etc, for me I have to admit that while I appreciate the skill and talent of shooting images of birds in flight, it is not what I want to shoot. So i picked the gear that suits what i like to shoot, with a few occasional use lenses thrown in for those times I feel I might need them. My A1 tends to get the longer lenses and the A7RV the wider ones, usually there is the 70-200 GM II on the A1 and the 24-70GM II on the A7RV, I also have the 100-400 GM and the 200-600 G for use when needed and the 14, 20 and 24, also sometime use.
Whatever interest or hobby I find my self doing, I usually buy the best I can afford as opposed to the start slowly and see if you like philosophy of my father, better gear puts less restrictions on learning and if you lose interest of the activity the equipment is easier to get rid of.
As to your computer needs, faster and bigger is always better, memory is what runs the whole thing the more the better. Fast large storage drives are always worth the expense to have multiples, especially as prices keep going down. I would not abandon Capture One for Lightroom, just add Photoshop and you will be good for anything.

 

[-ST-]

ST, have you thought of purchasing the ST from elsewhere i.e., outside of your region? You may have to pay import duty, but I'm guessing it won't be too much. I was about to purchase a 2x TC a few months ago in the UK but changed my mind in the end, so I'm guessing its still available here.

Thanks, Ed.
I'm on a waitlist with Sony Canada. I did that after finding them backordered at the major US retailers I checked.
Cheers,
ST

 

[AlphaWorld]

“Should I get an A1?”

1. Yes, you absolutely should! It is a fabulous camera, and the more people who buy one the more Sony will be encouraged to bring out the A1 mark II that I really really want, with the A7RV auto focus and the nifty rear screen.
2. No, you definitely should not! You have a perfectly good camera and should continue using it until it wears out. Staying with the one camera will allow you to grow your lens collection.
3. Maybe you should wait a little while to see if Sony brings out something really juicy this year…

There you are: now you have all the answers, and all you have to do is pick one Why did you say “smartaleck”?

I was one of many photographers with an A7RIV and an A9 who kept saying “if only Sony made a camera with the speed of the A9 and the resolution of the A7RIV…”, then SantaXXXXX Sony announced the A1, and got a barrage of pre-orders from us. At the time (January 2021) it was a delightful combination of surprise / shock / awe. Now it is 2 years later, and some of the awe has worn off. The A1 remains a brilliant camera, but we have seen some new cameras surpass it in little ways. The new AF in the A7RV gives me hope that an A1 mark II will reinstate the awe! I wait with anticipation. I’m also keen to see what will be in the A9III, not because I am likely to get one, but because some of its features will likely appear in the next A1.

None of us is really entitled to tell you what you should do (yeah, we will anyway). In the end, it’s your decision…

 

[AlphaWorld]

There are so many good responses to this thread, I won't attempt to modify the responses. I just want to address one of your statements. You said "nobody compares those two bodies". I actually read a response from a well known photographer-Educator, Mark Galer. He has been a Sony Ambassador for over 10 years and recently on his Q&A Forum, he did answer that question. Comparing the A7IV, the A7RV and the A1 in Auto focus performance, he didn't hesitate. Absolutely the A1. It's all about the stacked sensor. Now, the A1 is missing some of the latest bells and whistles but when you get down to pure performance, the A1 wins. I suspect that within a year, the A1 will incorporate these new improvements, but I have no information to back this up. One other thing, about lenses, and again about Mark Galer. The longest lens he normally shoots with (Other than testing) is the 100-400 GM and although he has tested the 1.4 & 2.0 TC, he does just fine without them. He does own a 200-600 but he feels it's too much to carry. Don't forget the light loss with the TC's. Just for grins, go to Flickr.com and look at Mark Galer's albums and how they are organized and you will have all the info you need, right there. Good luck in your quest. If I had your resources, I would just wait for the A1-II, but that is just me.

I very much doubt the current A1 will get the core part of the new AF, because that depends on separate hardware. Sure, the A1 can get Insect snd vehicle AF, but it will be at the same level as its current human / animal / bird AF, which is very good, but still fooled by intervening objects or head turned away. The next A1 will have it, I’m sure (and it will likely focus faster, too).

The A7RV AF isn’t faster, but it does seem to be more certain / more accurate (eventually!).

 

[-ST-]

Hi, Bob,

Sorry to take so long to get back to you. I had to go out and shoot some pictures and pursue a couple of my other all-consuming passions.

wow, quite a discussion going on here.

An old friend used to say, "... hammered out on the anvil of discussion". That's what this thread has been for me.
You may know it as “Freedom is hammered out on the anvil of discussion, dissent, and debate.” - Hubert H. Humphrey

All I have to add is I have both an A1 and an A7RV, love both, I do carry both camera many times when I shoot, or at least have both with me. I know I am supposed to say that after my 45+ years as a professional photographer ( shooting with a vast number of different camera sytems) that one should not chase the gear but instead chase the experience first.

That's great. I considered both of these cameras, so I appreciate your insights.

Well I actually think if you have the funds buy the best you can for the use you intend it for. The hard part sometimes is really deciding what is that use, is it wildlife, specifically birds or is it landscapes, portraits, etc, for me I have to admit that while I appreciate the skill and talent of shooting images of birds in flight, it is not what I want to shoot.

That is the hard part. The reason I want great gear (in any field) is to have the liberty to change direction on a whim. I may not remain enamoured with the outcome of a flight of fancy, but I want the option to go there to experience it.

So i picked the gear that suits what i like to shoot, with a few occasional use lenses thrown in for those times I feel I might need them. My A1 tends to get the longer lenses and the A7RV the wider ones, usually there is the 70-200 GM II on the A1 and the 24-70GM II on the A7RV, I also have the 100-400 GM and the 200-600 G for use when needed and the 14, 20 and 24, also sometime use.
Whatever interest or hobby I find my self doing, I usually buy the best I can afford as opposed to the start slowly and see if you like philosophy of my father, better gear puts less restrictions on learning and if you lose interest of the activity the equipment is easier to get rid of.

Yes. All-in without constraints, and if appropriate, all-out with no regrets.

As to your computer needs, faster and bigger is always better, memory is what runs the whole thing the more the better. Fast large storage drives are always worth the expense to have multiples, especially as prices keep going down. I would not abandon

It's not the little pauses that waste your time. It's the getting back on track after your mind wanders in those little pauses, that is the real time-waster.

Capture One for Lightroom, just add Photoshop and you will be good for anything.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Thanks for including a link to your work on Instagram!

 

[-ST-]

Thank you all for your thoughts and advice.
Epilogue

• ILCE-1
• Sony FE 70-200mm F2.8 GM OSS II (SEL70200GM2)
• 200.0 mm
• ƒ/2.8
• 1/2000 sec
• ISO 100

• ILCE-1
• Sony FE 70-200mm F2.8 GM OSS II (SEL70200GM2)
• 200.0 mm
• ƒ/2.8
• 1/2000 sec
• ISO 100

• ILCE-1
• Sony FE 70-200mm F2.8 GM OSS II (SEL70200GM2)
• 200.0 mm
• ƒ/2.8
• 1/2000 sec
• ISO 100

 

[AlphaWorld]

Looks like you are regretting it already Well, maybe regretting not getting it earlier?

How close did you have to get those shots at 200mm? They are impressive.

 

[evacguy]

Thank you all for your thoughts and advice.
Epilogue
View attachment 31358View attachment 31359View attachment 31360

Fantastic images - please let us know what/how you have concluded from the discussion? Are these your first shots with your new A1? Did you get another 70-200mm GM II?

 

[-ST-]

Fantastic images -

Thanks, Ed.

please let us know what/how you have concluded from the discussion? Are these your first shots with your new A1? Did you get another 70-200mm GM II?

The conclusion?
I knew folks would figure it out once they saw the metadata below the images.

The decision was "hammered out on the anvil of discussion." As I read and replied to all the generous responses in the thread, I decided to get the 70-200 GM II (again) and to give some more thought to those things the A1 can do that the A7IV can't. Without going into a long list, the big ones for me were fast burst shooting because I wanted to try action photography, and the higher resolution for deep crops to effectively increase the reach of the lens. There are some interesting differences for video, but I'm only just getting into that end of things.

I got the A1 and (another) 70-200 mm GM II with a CFexpress Type A 160 GB memory card.

I took them out for the first time yesterday. You might have seen that shot of the duck running on water. That was picked from a burst of about 20.

Last night I set up the A1 using Mark Galer's PAL workflow (Portrait, Action, Landscape). If you're not familiar with it, check it out. It will work well with your A7IV and you may find it makes it easier to switch between shooting Action and Landscape modes. I don't recall you showing us any Portrait work, but those settings can be used for other things too. Check out the link.

This morning, I got those shots of the eagle and about 450 more. Whew, it's a good thing it's easy to cull shots as part of the import process with Capture One.

Things I noticed immediately moving from the A7IV to the A1

• The A1 weighs about 70 grams more, and it's a difference you can feel in the hand
• The Electronic Viewfinder EVF is glorious! 9,437k dots vs 3690k dots. This was important to me because I shoot through the EVF most of the time.
• The silent shutter with no blackout between shots
• I nearly ran out of battery today
• My cheeks are sore from grinning

 

[-ST-]

I am presuming you got the A1, correct? Beautiful shots btw.

Hi, Chaitali,
You presume correctly. I'm having a ball. Thanks for the compliment.

 

[-ST-]

Looks like you are regretting it already

Well, maybe regretting not getting it earlier?

Not really. The A7IV served me well and brought me to the point where I could consider the next steps.

How close did you have to get those shots at 200mm? They are impressive.

Thanks!
The eagle took off from a perch about 15 meters (50 feet) above the ground. Those shots were probably at 20-25 meters (60-80 feet) from me. These are pretty deep crops. Here are a couple of screenshots from Capture One.

 

[Landshark99]

good choice, looks like it is working well

 

[AlphaWorld]

Not really. The A7IV served me well and brought me to the point where I could consider the next steps.

Thanks!
The eagle took off from a perch about 15 meters (50 feet) above the ground. Those shots were probably at 20-25 meters (60-80 feet) from me. These are pretty deep crops. Here are a couple of screenshots from Capture One.
View attachment 31367View attachment 31368

This is why we love the 50Mpixels of the A1 - chop away the dross and still have a good image. Your images look really good for such deep crops.

 

[evacguy]

Thanks, Ed.



The conclusion?
I knew folks would figure it out once they saw the metadata below the images.

The decision was "hammered out on the anvil of discussion." As I read and replied to all the generous responses in the thread, I decided to get the 70-200 GM II (again) and to give some more thought to those things the A1 can do that the A7IV can't. Without going into a long list, the big ones for me were fast burst shooting because I wanted to try action photography, and the higher resolution for deep crops to effectively increase the reach of the lens. There are some interesting differences for video, but I'm only just getting into that end of things.

I got the A1 and (another) 70-200 mm GM II with a CFexpress Type A 160 GB memory card.

I took them out for the first time yesterday. You might have seen that shot of the duck running on water. That was picked from a burst of about 20.

Last night I set up the A1 using Mark Galer's PAL workflow (Portrait, Action, Landscape). If you're not familiar with it, check it out. It will work well with your A7IV and you may find it makes it easier to switch between shooting Action and Landscape modes. I don't recall you showing us any Portrait work, but those settings can be used for other things too. Check out the link.

This morning, I got those shots of the eagle and about 450 more. Whew, it's a good thing it's easy to cull shots as part of the import process with Capture One.

Things I noticed immediately moving from the A7IV to the A1

• The A1 weighs about 70 grams more, and it's a difference you can feel in the hand
• The Electronic Viewfinder EVF is glorious! 9,437k dots vs 3690k dots. This was important to me because I shoot through the EVF most of the time.
• The silent shutter with no blackout between shots
• I nearly ran out of battery today
• My cheeks are sore from grinning

Thanks for the update, I'm sure you have made the right decision and I look forward to seeing more of your creations. Did you keep the A7iv or sell it on? Enjoy.

 

[-ST-]

Thanks for the update, I'm sure you have made the right decision and I look forward to seeing more of your creations. Did you keep the A7iv or sell it on? Enjoy.

Hey, Ed.

I've still got the A7IV. It's a wonderful camera.

There have been several situations lately where I've wished I had a second body. I've been doing some indoor photography and video at events. It should be really handy to have the PZ 16-35 on one body and a longer zoom on the other. It's also important to have a backup for events.

Last night I picked up another battery. I forgot to mention that I also got a battery grip for the A1 (that will also fit the A7IV). That will be for the events where weight should be less of an issue. I think I'm going to appreciate the extra battery life when I do longer videos, and the handle on the bottom of the battery grip is really comfortable for vertical shooting.

Thanks for asking.

 

[Unframed Dave]

Mrs Unframed will be chuffed.

Thanks a bunch.

Seriously, enjoy it. No pockets in a shroud.

 

[-ST-]

Mrs Unframed will be chuffed.

Thanks a bunch.

Seriously, enjoy it. No pockets in a shroud.

What an excellent expression.

 

[liggy]

Being a little late to this party my .02 would have been yes - if you have the means the A1 would be a better tool for your clearly stated goals, OP.

Congratulations and happy shooting!

 

[-ST-]

Loving the 50 megapixels and being able to get this

• ILCE-1
• Sony FE 70-200mm F2.8 GM OSS II (SEL70200GM2)
• 200.0 mm
• ƒ/2.8
• 1/2000 sec
• ISO 160

from this

It was a dreary, windy day in the drizzle, but I had a ball.

 

[Jeff A]

Loving the 50 megapixels and being able to get this
View attachment 31445
from this
View attachment 31446
It was a dreary, windy day in the drizzle, but I had a ball.

And your image is still well above 4K!

 

[martin]

For A1 owners, I'd sure appreciate your thoughts about whether or not I should get an A1. Thank you.

TLDR
I've got an A7IV with 24-105 F4 and PZ 16-35 F4. I'm going to wait for a 100-400 GM II for my next lens, and I know that could a while, although if I could find a 2x teleconverter, I'd get the 70-200 GM II again in a heartbeat.

I really like the A7IV, but I'd like to be able to crop in post more than I can with 33 megapixels. Also, I'm missing action shots (birds in flight) due to focus and frames-per-second issues (not enough frames per second).

I hope that getting the A1 will let me explore what I can do with 20-30 frames per second and faster focus tracking. This rules out the A7RV.

It might be nice to carry two bodies so I can have the 16-35 ready to go (on the A7IV) as well as the 24-105 on the A1. When I finally get my longer zoom lens, I'd probably put the 24-105 on the A7IV and the 100-400 on the A1.

I'm concerned that I'll miss the stacked selector (on the A7IV and A7RV) that lets me go from photos/video/F&S and keep separate settings for each mode. I don't shoot a lot of video, but when I switch to video it might be annoying to have to change the shutter speed aperture too.

I know the A1 will be two years old in a month. I'd be okay if I had a year before the A1 II came out. Odds are very good that if I like the A1, I'll get the A1 II. I'd be willing to lose 25-30% for a year of shooting.

Getting a better camera will not make me a better photographer, but I'm hoping that a more capable camera will help me to explore new photo opportunities.



Background
I got into photography six months ago, starting with an A7C but switched to the A7IV a week later.
Edit: In that time. I've shot about 36,000 photos over some 500 hours, with a similar amount of time working with the photos in post, over 100 hours in courses, and double that watching Sony-specific tutorials. /edit

I picked up the 24-105 F4 G OSS and started having a ball. A few months later, I got the PZ 16-35 for candid close-up shots of musicians and some landscapes. I added the 70-200 F2.8 GM II a couple of weeks ago. I'm out every day wandering around a beach and environmentally protected area, camera in hand, for two to three hours. I usually take up to 200 shots per day, keeping 25% of those. I use Capture One for post-processing.

I just returned the 70-200 GM II. I enjoyed that lens, and if that's what the version II GM lenses are like, then that's what I want going forward.

Too short, too long, 70-200
Unfortunately, I realized that I need more than 200 mm for wildlife. I liked the photos I was getting, but I was cropping in 200% and more to fill the frame or get the composition I wanted. My plan was to get a 2x teleconverter, but I can't find one anywhere, and nobody seems to know when they might be back in stock. At the other end, I found the 70 mm field of view terribly restricting. That's because I'm used to having 24 mm at the twist of the zoom ring (on my 24-105).

I would consider the 100-400 GM OSS, but the retailer who sold me the 70-200 GM II suggested I wait for the 100-400 GM II version of that lens. She said the same thing about the 200-600mm f/5.6-6.3 OSS G, although I'm convinced that lens is more than I want to carry for two to three hours.

Mulling it over
So what to do in the meantime? I considered A7RV so I would have more megapixels to crop. Even in APSC mode, I'd still have 26 megapixels to work with, but most of my discarded shots are of birds in flight. I dump those because of focus issues and the relatively low shots-per-second on the A7IV. That is, I need more shots from which to choose my keepers. I'm concerned that the A7RV is no faster than the A7IV and that I'll have rolling shutter issues on panning shots when I finally get my longer lens.

I've watched too many pixel-peeping comparisons of the A7RIV / A1 / A7IV, and the main conclusion for me is that the A1 compares as well or better than the A7RIV for image quality for anything I want to do. I wish the A1 had an articulating screen, though. I shoot through the Electronic Viewfinder most of the time, but once or twice a day, I flip out the screen for a portrait shot with the body low to the ground or above eye level. I'll have to shoot in landscape orientation and crop for those if I get the A1.

Thank you
Thank you for reading this far. Some of you have seen my photos and you can tell where I am on my journey. I'd gratefully appreciate your thoughts about whether an A1 is a good, immediate next step.

 

[martin]

Loving the 50 megapixels and being able to get this
View attachment 31445
from this
View attachment 31446
It was a dreary, windy day in the drizzle, but I had a ball.

stunning......the A1 is far the best camera for bird photography. I use the 200-600 with 1.4 converter. its heavy but you are ok if you use a fast enough shutter speed. eg 1/4000 if possible. Martin Henry

 

[Doug Herr]

I'm late to this thread, but FWIW: I won't tell you to buy or not buy any particular piece of hardware but I can tell you what I like about the a1.

Many of the a1's features are well-known but these stand out for me (my previous camera was the a7RIII):

1. Silent shutter with negligible rolling shutter distortion. Without the silent shutter, birds at close range would often allow only a single exposure before fleeing. If you want the critters to not react to you, the silent shutter is a big help.
2. 50 MP. Crop-ability. Enough said.
3. fast frame rate. I've not used 30 frames/sec, 20 is fast enough for me. The frame rate enables photos of brief moments that could easily be missed.
4. Bird eye AF. The camera finds the bird, finds the eye and locks onto it, even with erratic flight.

This photo illustrates several of these advantages:

• ILCE-1
• FE 600mm F4 GM OSS
• 600.0 mm
• ƒ/5.6
• 1/3200 sec
• ISO 1250

​

When I first saw this shrike it was hovering over a spot on the ground, sometime facing me, sometimes with its tail to me, flying left, right, up, down, forward, backward, and landing on the ground nearby; I framed loose so that I could keep the bird in the field of view, used silent shutter to minimize my disturbance (thankful for negligible distortion), and I used Bird eye AF set to the full image area so the camera would find the bird no matter where it was in the picture. 20 frames per second bursts captured the snake as it leapt toward the shrike and fell back to the ground, which took less than 1/4 sec. I didn't even know there was a snake until I reviewed the photos. This photo is cropped from horizontal and makes a very nice large print. It's possible the photo could have been made with the a7rIII but the a1 made it much more likely I'd get a good selection of keepers.

Should you buy an a1? That's up to you, but I like it so much that I bought a second body.

 

[Merlinator]

Never mind, I see you have bought the A1. Excellent choice. LOL