Focus Settings A7R IV + 200-600

[TerryL]

Hello,
I’m trying to shoot birds for the first time. I have bird feeders set up in my backyard and shoot from my deck. I want shots with birds on the feeder and as they fly away. My first attempt ended up with very blurry birds at 2000 shutter speed. How should I have my focus set up? Thank you for your help.
Terry

 

[Unframed Dave]

Terry, it might help if you include a couple of shots for folks to look at. There are a lot of variables and it will give them a starting point.

 

[Tim Mayo]

Can you post your shots Terry? I’d try with OSS on as you might still get some movement on the tripod. Are you using AF-C? Which focus area were you using?

 

[iamdlewis]

With the A7R4 first make sure you are using the mechanical shutter. The best AF to use will depend on how you are going to be shooting this.
1) If you are keeping the camera still you'll want to use the Wide or the Zone to the side of the feeder that is open.
2) If you are moving the camera on the tripod you'll want most likely Wide but the Expand + Tracking can work with this but it will be more manual.
Since we don't know the birds that are coming to your feeder I will assume that they are small birds so you'll most likely want shutter speeds more like 1/3200 but this you will test as the best speed will vairy by bird.

Another thing to try is to use the APS-C mode as that will greatly help with the AF tracking.

 

[Loke]

With the A7R4 first make sure you are using the mechanical shutter. The best AF to use will depend on how you are going to be shooting this.
1) If you are keeping the camera still you'll want to use the Wide or the Zone to the side of the feeder that is open.
2) If you are moving the camera on the tripod you'll want most likely Wide but the Expand + Tracking can work with this but it will be more manual.
Since we don't know the birds that are coming to your feeder I will assume that they are small birds so you'll most likely want shutter speeds more like 1/3200 but this you will test as the best speed will vairy by bird.

Another thing to try is to use the APS-C mode as that will greatly help with the AF tracking.

I never though about the APS-C, this would probably help me with tracking and composing shots of far distance birds also, since i often crop it anyways. Thank you for a good tip! I programmed APS-C to my C3, going to try remember to use it!

Do you recommend wide or zone also on perching birds? I've been experimenting a lot with focus modes lately aswell since im also new in photographing birds. Been trying the tracking expand spot, but i often feel i miss eye focus when i have a lot of branches etc, but i guess this is the hard part of bird photography.

 

[spudhead]

Some strange ideas being thrown around regarding setup

 

[TerryL]

Can you post your shots Terry? I’d try with OSS on as you might still get some movement on the tripod. Are you using AF-C? Which focus area were you using?

Can you post your shots Terry? I’d try with OSS on as you might still get some movement on the tripod. Are you using AF-C? Which focus area were you using?

They are posted.

• ILCE-7RM4
• FE 200-600mm F5.6-6.3 G OSS
• 600.0 mm
• ƒ/6.3
• 1/2000 sec
• ISO 32000

• Edit 3.1.00.01080

• Edit 3.1.00.01080

 

[TerryL]

Terry, it might help if you include a couple of shots for folks to look at. There are a lot of variables and it will give them a starting point.

Terry, it might help if you include a couple of shots for folks to look at. There are a lot of variables and it will give them a starting point.

Heres one,

• Edit 3.1.00.01080

 

[Unframed Dave]

OK, try uploading as full size images rather than thumbnails. This brings in the exif data, camera body, lens, focal length, shutter speed, iso, etc.

If you are using a long telephoto, the depth of field can be very shallow at large apertures, the feeder appears to be crystal, so if that is your point of focus, it is unlikely that the birds will be sharp. As your background is out of focus completely, im going to assume a largish aperture. One is behind the feeder, the other is in front. Where wildlife is concerned, especially small animals like birds, point of focus is critical and you really need to be on the eye.

In a lot of editing programmes, the point of focus can be displayed, try looking at that and it'll give you a big clue.

A lot of practice is required with birds in flight and the smaller the bird, the more difficult it is. I speak from experience when I say that you have chosen one of the most frustrating fields of photography there is.

I'm also going to suggest that your sensor may need a clean, there appears to be dust showing on the images.

Keep going, it's very satisfying when it comes together.

 

[TerryL]

Thank you Dave.

 

[Phil Vetra]

Hello,
I know that are members that shoot this lens with amazing results. So, I just bought one. My first use was shots of birds on my bird feeder from my deck. I used a tripod, and my shutter speed was set at 2000, and iso set on auto. I was very disappointed at the results. What I would like to do is test my lens to make sure I have a good copy and the results were user error. Will someone tell me what to do to test the lens? I have the oss off, Thank you for your help.
Terry

Don't forget if you or anyone else are moving on your deck that will set up vibrations into the tripod. The same is true in boggy or soft ground. Just my 2 cents.

 

[iamdlewis]

I never though about the APS-C, this would probably help me with tracking and composing shots of far distance birds also, since i often crop it anyways. Thank you for a good tip! I programmed APS-C to my C3, going to try remember to use it!

Do you recommend wide or zone also on perching birds? I've been experimenting a lot with focus modes lately aswell since im also new in photographing birds. Been trying the tracking expand spot, but i often feel i miss eye focus when i have a lot of branches etc, but i guess this is the hard part of bird photography.

APS-C mode will help with tracking birds in flight like if you are going for birds in an opening field. What you are trying to do I am not sure how it would work, I've never tried to get birds leaving a feeder, usually coming into a feeder would be better. For what you are doing I would probably use the Expand Flexible Spot with Tracking. That said I personally don't like feeders in my shots so I would be looking for a perch somewhere without the feeder in the shot.

Some strange ideas being thrown around regarding setup

What would those strange ideas be?

A lot of practice is required with birds in flight and the smaller the bird, the more difficult it is. I speak from experience when I say that you have chosen one of the most frustrating fields of photography there is.

True and true.

To Loke: Best to start with larger birds like geese and gulls then move onto smaller ones. Don't be surprised if you have a keeper rate of 10% or less (just because it is in focus doesn't make it a keeper). When you are practicing also try using different metering modes and changing your auto ISO range.

 

[Tim Mayo]

From your images posted it looks like the feeder is in focus. Where were you focusing and which focus area? Also at 32000 ISO you will loose most of the detail from the birds. I'm guessing the light wasn't great that day? The other images don't show the EXIF. When you save as JPEG make sure you check the box to include EXIF / Metadata with the image.

If you want to catch the birds flying away from the table then you could experiment with using Tracking with Center Focus Area. I'd probably go a little faster for these subjects than 1/2000 for a higher megapixel cameras like the A7RIV. However, as you've seen if the light isn't great your ISO will be through the roof and this will really kill the details.

It's easier to get this type of shot when you know the path that the bird is taking. If you need to move to track them it's very easy to lose them.

They can also be difficult shots with the A7RIV compared to a camera like the A9 Series of A1 since these cameras have faster sensor readout speeds and perform more AF/AE calculations per second which are important for fast head-on shots. That's not to say you can't get these shots with the A7RIV but your keeper rate will always be lower. If you have no joy using this method you could also try manually focussing on a point that you know the birds will fly past then shoot at the maximum of 10 fps.

Also like iamdlewis mentioned, make sure you are using the mechanical and not electronic shutter for moving subjects otherwise your shots might suffer from the effects of rolling shutter.

 

[Uncle Kevriano]

I'll make it simple, and this is how I shoot, which works perfectly.

Forget tracking modes, waste of time, especially on small birds.
Shutter 1/3200th, no less
f7.1 is the sweet spot on the 200 600
Auto ISO
Most important, single centre point focus
Turn off OSS on the lens
Shoot mechanical shutter only
Practice!

 

[spudhead]

I am pretty much where Kev is on this one, I have had many of the sony a and e-mount cameras and have the a9 and 1 so don`t worry about shutter roll, if people look at others shots on here and any site the failures all come down to a few factors, and the biggest single one is shutter speed too slow.
To set a camera to wide or zone for small birds visiting a fixed feeder is crazy, I never use wide the camera has no clue what to focus on, I have all the toys on the a9 and a1but I do not use tacking ever, I do not use oss or stability ever, just higher shutter speed. Eye focus don`t use it ever, its a not needed get the head in focus and the eye is in focus, less is more.

 

[TerryL]

OK, try uploading as full size images rather than thumbnails. This brings in the exif data, camera body, lens, focal length, shutter speed, iso, etc.

If you are using a long telephoto, the depth of field can be very shallow at large apertures, the feeder appears to be crystal, so if that is your point of focus, it is unlikely that the birds will be sharp. As your background is out of focus completely, im going to assume a largish aperture. One is behind the feeder, the other is in front. Where wildlife is concerned, especially small animals like birds, point of focus is critical and you really need to be on the eye.

In a lot of editing programmes, the point of focus can be displayed, try looking at that and it'll give you a big clue.

A lot of practice is required with birds in flight and the smaller the bird, the more difficult it is. I speak from experience when I say that you have chosen one of the most frustrating fields of photography there is.

I'm also going to suggest that your sensor may need a clean, there appears to be dust showing on the images.

Keep going, it's very satisfying when it comes together.

I'll make it simple, and this is how I shoot, which works perfectly.

Forget tracking modes, waste of time, especially on small birds.
Shutter 1/3200th, no less
f7.1 is the sweet spot on the 200 600
Auto ISO
Most important, single centre point focus
Turn off OSS on the lens
Shoot mechanical shutter only
Practice!

Hi Kev,
I’m confused about what you mean by single center point focus. Are you referring to focus area center?
Thank you,
Terry

 

[Uncle Kevriano]

Hi Kev,
I’m confused about what you mean by single center point focus. Are you referring to focus area center?
Thank you,
Terry

Yes, centre point, single centre, whatever they call it. It's by far the most accurate because the algorithm is just looking at one focus point to lock on.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

the most accurate because the algorithm is just looking at one focus point to lock on

Isn't that the case with a small flexible spot? Just curious...

 

[Uncle Kevriano]

Isn't that the case with a small flexible spot? Just curious...

The problem with flexible spot is that it gets distracted, like other modes do. It's also very small, so I found it didn't lock on anywhere near as well, it's harder to aim where you want it.

 

[TerryL]

I’ve never used afc or tracking before. I’m really not sure if it’s on or not. Wouldn’t I increase the focus points too. I expected to see tracking working in the viewfinder. Doesn’t afc mean continuous focusing? I’m practicing on the squirrels in my yard. I have my camera set at afc and wide. It seems like I’m missing something. I expected to see focus points follow the squirrels. What am I doing wrong?

 

[Uncle Kevriano]

I’ve never used afc or tracking before. I’m really not sure if it’s on or not. Wouldn’t I increase the focus points too. I expected to see tracking working in the viewfinder. Doesn’t afc mean continuous focusing? Thank you.
Terry

Yes AF C - Auto Focus Constant. That's the mode, and I have mine focus priority set to 1 - Locked On

 

[TerryL]

Yes AF C - Auto Focus Constant. That's the mode, and I have mine focus priority set to 1 - Locked On

Great. I’ll try that tomorrow.

 

[Thad E Ginathom]

I’m really not sure if it’s on or not

What am I doing wrong?

Not watching the youtube videos and/or reading the books.

You just have to spend an evening or two getting to grips with the camera basics: focusing and exposure. There is heaps of stuff it will do for/with you. But you need to find out about it.

 

[TerryL]

Not watching the youtube videos and/or reading the books.

You just have to spend an evening or two getting to grips with the camera basics: focusing and exposure. There is heaps of stuff it will do for/with you. But you need to find out about it.

Yes Thad, I do both. I do enjoy the forums, though.

 

[Richard A]

This has turned into an interesting thread. The only BIF photos I have really ever taken are the ones in my gallery from a couple of months ago which I think turned out pretty well. I would like to try more of this and will give the settings suggested by @spudhead and @Uncle Kevriano a try.

 

[TerryL]

Yes, I agree. Your gallery is nice Richard. I don’t post much, but I do have 11x14 prints hanging on wall all over my house. I enjoy the framing process, too. I really regret getting my 200-600 lens. I just don’t enjoy using it. I should have gotten the 100–400 GM. I could have done other things with it. Take care.
Terry

 

[Richard A]

You should persist with it, with the advice given. You learn something new every day. I got a Tamron 50-400 when I bought all this Sony gear before Christmas. I put a topic on DP Review asking for suggestions on third party lenses and this lens got a lot of likes. So far I have found it to be a very nice lens indeed. One of the main reasons I changed brands to Sony was the huge selection of lenses.

I have been out quite a few nights this last week trying to perfect my time lapse video techniques but that is another story!

 

[TerryL]

T

You should persist with it, with the advice given. You learn something new every day. I got a Tamron 50-400 when I bought all this Sony gear before Christmas. I put a topic on DP Review asking for suggestions on third party lenses and this lens got a lot of likes. So far I have found it to be a very nice lens indeed. One of the main reasons I changed brands to Sony was the huge selection of lenses.

I have been out quite a few nights this last week trying to perfect my time lapse video techniques but that is another story.

 

[TerryL]

Thank you Richard. I’ll do just that. I’m trying to figure out if I have a sharp copy now. I’m also trying to figure out what gimbal to use. I have a great tripod. What gimbal are you using?
Terry

 

[Raz]

Hello,
I’m trying to shoot birds for the first time. I have bird feeders set up in my backyard and shoot from my deck. I want shots with birds on the feeder and as they fly away. My first attempt ended up with very blurry birds at 2000 shutter speed. How should I have my focus set up? Thank you for your help.
Terry

Hi.

There should be no problem like you describe.

I use a tripod and a remote shutter control. The EXIF from the photo below may help you.