Thoughts on genuine Sony mount lenses and third party options for the system, are you Sony only have you got a mix of both

[spudhead]

Ok we have many chats on here about lenses usually Sony native, but what do you think about Sony line up, quality, value, results in use, and what about third party options how do they work on the system, results , value, What do you want in lens line up moving forward? Have a say anything lens related

 

[Deleted Member 5045]

We could scroll back a year ago and find me saying the opposite of this because I was a Sigma fan boy for a while, but here goes...

Unless a certain focal range on a lens is made only by a third party manufacturer I would choose a Sony lens every time. Build quality wise I think Sigma Art are the best, but the metal body gathers finger prints. Sony are more of a workman's lens and the plastic construction just gives me more confidence of not getting scuffing marks on it also. Tamron and Samyang just look cheap to me so that's the only reason I'd steer clear of them, not to say they are 'cheap' because my 28-200mm still operates and looks the same as the day I got it, but yes that's just me, I like to admire well made things.

Image quality wise I wouldn't have any issues with owning Sigma, Tamron, Samyang or Sony, but I guess I just like the industrial look of the Sony lenses the most so that's why I'd buy them first.

Overall, Sigma Art is the best value overall I think. Absolutely beautifully made instruments.

 

[Brownie]

Brand Agnostic. I don't give a rat's fat ass who made it. If it does what's needed, who cares? Limiting oneself to a single manufacturer due to branding is the exact definition of a fanboy. There is no logical reason.

 

[iamdlewis]

5 of my 6 lens are Sony but that really wasn't planned. 4 of the lens didn't really have a 3rd party option when I was in the market. The 50mm macro does have a 3rd party option but the Sony was available used at a cheaper price.

Long lens I would only go Sony due to Sony limiting the frame rate but anything else I will do my research and get the lens that best meets my needs.

 

[GT12]

I went to the World Wildlife Photographer exhibition today. Amazing stuff. There were Sigma, Tamron and all sorts of lenses used in the shots. Not all of them high end. And winners of several categories were shot at ISO in the 3000s. Some older Sony bodies featured. And by the way, I did actually look at the photos and not just the exif data. The exhibition really made me think that great photography is created by great photographers. Gear helps but only to a point.

 

[Deleted Member 5045]

Brand Agnostic. I don't give a rat's fat ass who made it. If it does what's needed, who cares? Limiting oneself to a single manufacturer due to branding is the exact definition of a fanboy. There is no logical reason.

Is preferring the look of something not a logical reason?

I like skinny blonde girls best because they look the sexiest to me. I like Yamaha best because my favourite colour is blue. I also think brunettes are also hot, and I do believe that none of the major Japanese bike manufacturers are technically better than the other.

I think the definition of a fan boy is someone who believes that their favourite brand is clearly better than the other brands in every way.

 

[Deleted Member 5045]

I went to the World Wildlife Photographer exhibition today. Amazing stuff. There were Sigma, Tamron and all sorts of lenses used in the shots. Not all of them high end. And winners of several categories were shot at ISO in the 3000s. Some older Sony bodies featured. And by the way, I did actually look at the photos and not just the exif data. The exhibition really made me think that great photography is created by great photographers. Gear helps but only to a point.

I have a motocross and mountain bike background and I've always viewed photography similarly. Give a mad rider an average bike and he'll still be able to ride it pretty quick. Give a sh*t rider a great bike, and he'll still be sh*t as. But give a great rider a great bike and he'll be gifted enough to benefit from the small advantage.

 

[Brownie]

Is preferring the look of something not a logical reason?

I like skinny blonde girls best because they look the sexiest to me. I like Yamaha best because my favourite colour is blue. I also think brunettes are also hot, and I do believe that none of the major Japanese bike manufacturers are technically better than the other.

I think the definition of a fan boy is someone who believes that their favourite brand is clearly better than the other brands in every way.

Not when it comes to overall value V. performance, no

Does the Skinny blonde girl perform better, or at least as good as the more expensive model? If so, then good for you!

You seem upset, did you think my comment was directed toward you? Did my comment say: 'because of the way they look', or because of branding? Don't you own lenses other than Sony and stated as such in your post? Given all of that, why so sensitive?

 

[Deleted Member 5045]

Not when it comes to overall value V. performance, no

Does the Skinny blonde girl perform better, or at least as good as the more expensive model? If so, then good for you!

You seem upset, did you think my comment was directed toward you? Did my comment say: 'because of the way they look', or because of branding? Don't you own lenses other than Sony and stated as such in your post? Given all of that, why so sensitive?

Probably got a bit carried away. Was more so asking if you consider just purely liking the look of something more to be a logical reason..?

P.s Yes, the skinny blonde girls do perform better...

 

[Brownie]

P.s Yes, the skinny blonde girls do perform better...

My experience as well!

 

[Deleted Member 5045]

why so sensitive?

I'm going through my gender transition. It's not easy...

 

[spudhead]

An idea of if the third party lenses work well on the Sony bodies would be helpful to some of us

 

[Matthias]

I own a Zeiss Loxia lens, it performs very well. It is manual focus and has contacts so when you take a photo you will have the correct metadata, it also automatically goes in magnification view when turning the focus ring. At that time I was looking for a wide angle lens and I good get this for a very good price (new), I would definitely recommend this lens. I also love the build quality as it is made of metal, it feels solid. The only downside is that is hard to mount and unmount as there is only a very narrow non-moving ring that you need to grip.

All my other lenses are Sony lenses and I could also recommend those.

 

[Brownie]

An idea of if the third party lenses work well on the Sony bodies would be helpful to some of us

I can report on those I use. I'm not going to go into the burst rate constraints that Sony imposes on third party manufacturers, or TC use, or anything like that. They're all the same. All have top drawer AF or I'd have sold them.

Tamron:
17-28, excellent with thousands of shots to draw from.
50-400, excellent early results, few hundred shots.

Sigma:
100-400, excellent with thousands of shots to draw from. Maybe slightly slower AF.

Samyang:
35/1.4, Excellent. Not used a lot but has never disappointed.
24/1.8, Amazing early results with hundreds of shots.

Rokinon (Samyang)
135/1.8, Another excellent lens, early results hundreds of shots.

I hate to say these are really 'great lenses for the money', because that makes it sounds as if they're only good when compared to a more expensive lens. The fact is that these are all great lenses, period.

Total cost for all of these lenses combined was $4350, and the Sigma is for sale since I just got the Tamron, that will drop the total price to well below $4k. A suite of FF lenses with excellent performance for under $4k?

One manual focus lens, the Samyang 12mm, jury is still out. I really don't use it much, the few times I have the images have that artsy 'dreamy' quality to the focus. Not a fan. Could be me, I have no desire to mess with it further. I suspect it's one of their early lenses. Fortunately they've stepped up their game on the newer stuff.

I do understand that you guys shooting small fast BIF will prefer the faster burst rate and AF available with the Sony lenses, but unless you're using the A1 or one of the A9s, the camera won't do it anyway. Also note that from what I've seen with the newer third-party stuff, the differential in AF speed has virtually disappeared.

Now, if you ever want to discuss A-Mount and Sony's line of lens adapters...

 

[spudhead]

I can report on those I use. I'm not going to go into the burst rate constraints that Sony imposes on third party manufacturers, or TC use, or anything like that. They're all the same. All have top drawer AF or I'd have sold them.

Tamron:
17-28, excellent with thousands of shots to draw from.
50-400, excellent early results, few hundred shots.

Sigma:
100-400, excellent with thousands of shots to draw from. Maybe slightly slower AF.

Samyang:
35/1.4, Excellent. Not used a lot but has never disappointed.
24/1.8, Amazing early results with hundreds of shots.

Rokinon (Samyang)
135/1.8, Another excellent lens, early results hundreds of shots.

I hate to say these are really 'great lenses for the money', because that makes it sounds as if they're only good when compared to a more expensive lens. The fact is that these are all great lenses, period.

Total cost for all of these lenses combined was $4350, and the Sigma is for sale since I just got the Tamron, that will drop the total price to well below $4k. A suite of FF lenses with excellent performance for under $4k?

One manual focus lens, the Samyang 12mm, jury is still out. I really don't use it much, the few times I have the images have that artsy 'dreamy' quality to the focus. Not a fan. Could be me, I have no desire to mess with it further. I suspect it's one of their early lenses. Fortunately they've stepped up their game on the newer stuff.

I do understand that you guys shooting small fast BIF will prefer the faster burst rate and AF available with the Sony lenses, but unless you're using the A1 or one of the A9s, the camera won't do it anyway. Also note that from what I've seen with the newer third-party stuff, the differential in AF speed has virtually disappeared.

Now, if you ever want to discuss A-Mount and Sony's line of lens adapters...

Thanks Tim this is the sort of insight I think will help members your last comments are for another thread hopefully

 

[liggy]

Brand agnostic gear slut here.

About the only thing I really want on FE Mount is something like the Nikon 800mm PF lens. I just don’t want to spend $13K on the 600GM.

As to 3rd party lenses I’ve been on a Voigtlander kick lately. They look great. They feel beautifully damped. The rendering is sweet - not bitingly sharp but with a certain something. For Sony I have the 15 4.5 and 40 1.2

The recent Tamrons (I’ve had the 17-28, 70-180 2.8s and still have the 35-150, 28-200 and 28-75G2) are excellent. They don’t feel quite as good as a GM but the 35-150 could be a GM lens imo aside from the frame rate limitation.

Samyang is a mixed bag but the 135 1.8 is a terrific lens. I don’t use that prime often but imo unless you need the very best af and frame rate there’s no reason to get the GM version.

 

[FowlersFreeTime]

For the APSC lenses, Sony design seems to work out best most of the time: weather proofing, solid construction, excellent AF and optical performance. Third-party lenses take the spotlight if Sony doesn't offer a specific focal range or aperture, AND third party lenses like Tamron and Sigma are always more affordable.

Consider the f2.8 standard zooms for APSC line-up:
- Sony 16-55 f2.8, $1300, excellent sharpness, no OSS, pricey.
- Sigma 18-50 f2.8, $550, very good sharpness, no OSS, smaller focal range, excellent value.
- Tamron 17-70 f2.8, $700, good sharpness, Vibration Compensation (VC), best focal range, great value.

Of those 3, I went with Tamron because of the cost and focal range, and VC.

EDIT: Not to forget that Sigma still has some of the best primes for the APSC: 16mm, 23mm, 30mm, 56mm, and they're all 1.4 and sharp as a razor.

 

[spudhead]

Is preferring the look of something not a logical reason?

I like skinny blonde girls best because they look the sexiest to me. I like Yamaha best because my favourite colour is blue. I also think brunettes are also hot, and I do believe that none of the major Japanese bike manufacturers are technically better than the other.

I think the definition of a fan boy is someone who believes that their favourite brand is clearly better than the other brands in every way.

I dont know Clint I need to like but since you are butting heads with Tim there is no good place so I will just pick a reply

 

[Landshark99]

I disagree that buying only the camera brand lens makes one a fan boy, a fan boy is one who does things only because of the name. I have for pretty much my whole career mostly used the lenses the camera company made/branded and since I have shot with Nikon, Canon, Fuji, Hasselblad, Mamiya, Olympus, Panasonic etc it is hard to see me as a fan boy. I have done this for a few reasons, most of the time the camera brand lens was designed to work with that camera so the mount, the af, metering all work at their best, this not to say the independents do not work well it is just that by there very nature compromises are sometimes made so that they can work on many brands. Another reason for me, having shot professionally for many years, was the availability of a rental, loaner, replacement and repair services through the camera brand's Pro Services organizations ( Canon, Nikon and Sony all have these) as well as the photo rental houses around the world. Example I had bought a brand new lens that when I received it all seemed good, unfortunately i put it away for a few months, went to use it and the lens would not function, too late to return it. So I dropped it off at the Sony Pro Service facility, two days later they told me they would have a news lens to me the next day.
Value is a personal decision and choice, some times the expensive choice is a better value because it holds it's value, ie I waste money on all sorts of hobbies, the more expensive wines, knives and guitars i have bought are all now worth more than I paid for them where the cheaper ones I can barley give away. With camera gear that is not usually true except in rare occasions but the camera branded lenses are usually easier to sell in the second hand market. Look at the end of the day it is what ever makes you happy.

 

[Brownie]

I dont know Clint I need to like but since you are butting heads with Tim there is no good place so I will just pick a reply

We're not butting heads, he explained he's going through transgender transition and is hyper sensitive.

 

[Brownie]

I disagree that buying only the camera brand lens makes one a fan boy, a fan boy is one who does things only because of the name. I have for pretty much my whole career mostly used the lenses the camera company made/branded and since I have shot with Nikon, Canon, Fuji, Hasselblad, Mamiya, Olympus, Panasonic etc it is hard to see me as a fan boy. I have done this for a few reasons, most of the time the camera brand lens was designed to work with that camera so the mount, the af, metering all work at their best, this not to say the independents do not work well it is just that by there very nature compromises are sometimes made so that they can work on many brands. Another reason for me, having shot professionally for many years, was the availability of a rental, loaner, replacement and repair services through the camera brand's Pro Services organizations ( Canon, Nikon and Sony all have these) as well as the photo rental houses around the world. Example I had bought a brand new lens that when I received it all seemed good, unfortunately i put it away for a few months, went to use it and the lens would not function, too late to return it. So I dropped it off at the Sony Pro Service facility, two days later they told me they would have a news lens to me the next day.
Value is a personal decision and choice, some times the expensive choice is a better value because it holds it's value, ie I waste money on all sorts of hobbies, the more expensive wines, knives and guitars i have bought are all now worth more than I paid for them where the cheaper ones I can barley give away. With camera gear that is not usually true except in rare occasions but the camera branded lenses are usually easier to sell in the second hand market. Look at the end of the day it is what ever makes you happy.

Another hypersensitive person.

Here's what I said, since some of you can't seem to separate a factual statement from their personal feelings:

"Limiting oneself to a single manufacturer due to branding is the exact definition of a fanboy"

If you are buying Sony lenses only because they say Sony, you are a fanboy.

Having available loaners for a pro has no bearing on this discussion. Everyone is aware of how the big three staff repair stations at events like the Olympics, World Cup, etc.

And if we really want to go way back, there was a time when third party lenses weren't even available.

Let's look at resale value. MPB has the Sony 100-400 for $2,049 in like new condition. It costs $2,398 new. That's a loss of $349 if we could get the same price as MPB. We can't, but for the sake of discussion let's pretend we can.

The Sigma 100-400 is $764, same condition. New, it's $949. Loss is $185.

In the meantime I'll tell all of my Gibsons, Fenders, Colts and Rugers I made the right choice. They'll be thrilled!

 

[Jeff A]

I had all Sony lenses except for a 100-400 Sigma. A fine lens to be sure but I sold it and replaced it with the Sony 100-400 GM because of faster AF and the ability to use a Teleconverter. I now have the Sony 1.4 TC. Certainly I paid a premium for that change but I have been happy with my choices in that regard.

 

[spudhead]

We're not butting heads, he explained he's going through transgender transition and is hyper sensitive.

Ok it over my pay grade

 

[Landshark99]

Another hypersensitive person.

Having available loaners for a pro has no bearing on this discussion. Everyone is aware of how the big three staff repair stations at events like the Olympics, World Cup, etc.

And if we really want to go way back, there was a time when third party lenses weren't even available.

Let's look at resale value. MPB has the Sony 100-400 for $2,049 in like new condition. It costs $2,398 new. That's a loss of $349 if we could get the same price as MPB. We can't, but for the sake of discussion let's pretend we can.

The Sigma 100-400 is $764, same condition. New, it's $949. Loss is $185.

I am not sure who the sensitive one is here, I was just explaining my position on the subject. I have no issue with yours.
The Pro services while they do make a big splash at large sporting events, they are also available every day to deal with what ever camera and lens needs or issues one might have. So it is something to consider when making a lens purchase if you are able to make it work for you.

In your example of resale value the Sigma held on to 80% of it's purchase price and the Sony held onto 85%.
Even though it is more expensive, I think it will still be easier to sell the Sony used.
Looking at the values when buying and selling to KEH and B&H, the used buying value was only KEH because B&H did not have a used one in stock.
All the valuations were for almost new condition
Used valuation at near new condition for both

Sigma 100-400 lens
Sold to B&H $345 holds 32% of value
Sold to KEH $492 holds 46% of value
Buy used almost new from KEH $899 83% of value
Buy New from B&H $1080 with tripod mount

Sony 100-400 lens
Sold to B&H $1140 holds 48% of value
Sold to KEH $1448 holds 60% of value
Buy used almost new from KEH $2040 holds 85% of value
Buy new from B&H $2398

As to guitars and other things it is all model, condition and or year dependent for used valuations

 

[Deleted Member 5045]

We're not butting heads, he explained he's going through transgender transition and is hyper sensitive.

I think that was the last bit of my male hormones lashing out. I woke up this morning and couldn't go to the toilet, I feel dreadful, run down, nauseas, paranoid and most of my body feels like it's on fire. My doctor who is just the most 'amazing' thing I'll add, I called this morning in fear for my life and it/that said that if I feel completely mentally and physically ****** up, then my hormone blockers are working perfectly.

Such a wonderful inclusive world which allows professionals to administer chemically incarcerating drugs to whoever 'needs' them. Thank god for this new age science they've discovered in recent years that we had no idea existed for centuries and centuries.

 

[spudhead]

I am not sure who the sensitive one is here, I was just explaining my position on the subject. I have no issue with yours.
The Pro services while they do make a big splash at large sporting events, they are also available every day to deal with what ever camera and lens needs or issues one might have. So it is something to consider when making a lens purchase if you are able to make it work for you.

In your example of resale value the Sigma held on to 80% of it's purchase price and the Sony held onto 85%
Looking at the values when buying and selling to KEH and B&H, the used buying value was only KEH because B&H did not have a used one in stock.
All the valuations were for almost new condition
Used valuation at near new condition for both

Sigma 100-400 lens
Sold to B&H $345 holds 32% of value
Sold to KEH $492 holds 46% of value
Buy used almost new from KEH $899 83% of value
Buy New from B&H $1080 with tripod mount

Sony 100-400 lens
Sold to B&H $1140 holds 48% of value
Sold to KEH $1448 holds 60% of value
Buy used almost new from KEH $2040 holds 85% of value
Buy new from B&H $2398

As to guitars and other things it is all model, condition and or year dependent for used valuatio

I think that was the last bit of my male hormones lashing out. I woke up this morning and couldn't go to the toilet, I feel dreadful, run down, nauseas, paranoid and most of my body feels like it's on fire. My doctor who is just the most 'amazing' thing I'll add, I called this morning in fear for my life and it/that said that if I feel completely mentally and physically ****** up, then my hormone blockers are working perfectly.

Such a wonderful inclusive world which allows professionals to administer chemically incarcerating drugs to whoever 'needs' them. Thank god for this new age science they've discovered in recent years that we had no idea existed for centuries and centuries.

WOW

 

[Deleted Member 5045]

WOW

 

[spudhead]

Let it all out babe

 

[Deleted Member 5045]

Let it all out babe

Going to be a lot more than hoodless soon when I get my surgery. Can't wait!

 

[Landshark99]

Such a wonderful inclusive world which allows professionals to administer chemically incarcerating drugs to whoever 'needs' them. Thank god for this new age science they've discovered in recent years that we had no idea existed for centuries and centuries.

"It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice."
I know I am stepping into something here I was trying to avoid but I am not sure how those two statements go together.
Gender identity issues are not new issues that have been around forever, they are just now coming out in public and are being addressed with that "new age science".
If you have ever known anyone going through the painful struggle of this, compassion is what is needed. Maybe 45 years ago i knew a very successful advertising photographer that used the same lab as me, he left his business to deal with this issue, when he returned as a transitioning woman i always admired their courage to put their career back together, visiting the same clients instead of leaving town to start over. The great thing back then was the friends and clients were empathetic and their career came back as good as it was before the transformation. If one has ever had these issues happen to somebody close to them, maybe a little understanding and empathy might help them with their life.
My only trepidation to posting this is, I came to these forums to discuss whatever the forum is supposed to be about, photography, not for politics, if one wants that discussion there are plenty of places to post ones thoughts. We all gather here i believe to get away from always talking about politics, religion and other societal issues even when joking.