Pain and Photography

[Ralph]

• ILCE-7M3
• 100-400mm F5-6.3 DG DN OS | Contemporary 020
• 400.0 mm
• ƒ/6.3
• 1/1250 sec
• ISO 500

Photo for interest side of things only.

1st please I am asking for no pity on this. This is just an observation I have come to notice as I am getting older.
Not too long ago I went out the local photo group and we had two 10 seater buses.
While driving to a 1st point of call we hit a few bumps or holes in the road and they had an instant impact on my.
My back were from sore 2 or 3 out of 10 to 9.5 out of 10. If I was in my car I would of turned around and went straight back home.

So we get to the 1st place and I hobble or limp to gt about and trying my best to fit in.
We started to walk about and people had their camera's up clicking away and I was so slow off the mark.
Place 2 same story and was the 3rd and last. I was so looking forwards to getting home.

I had to lay down to download my photo's and I got 9 bird and not one shot could be posted just looking as it was, they all needed work.
I can get shots on quite a lot of occasions ready to post straight out of the camera but not this time. and with 30 shots in total most of an eagle
flying past..

The the one I had partnered up with for the day told me she had got 31 birds.
Making it as I thought, that pain in now playing havoc on my ability to get get shots and to get shots where the smaller bird was moving.
I seen her shots that she posted and we were together all day and she got photo's of birds I have even seen.

This has been a progressive thing happening to me and I now we plan outings. Get up early and if I wake up and while having my coffee I will determine
on weather or not I am going to go out or turn around and go back to bed.
Of late it has been going back to bed which I have been doing a lot of lately.

Does anyone else in my position find this same sort of thing happening with them and if so do you have any little tricks to get around this and I have tries many things to no avail.

So please no you poor bugger or things like this as this is my life and I have to handle it or find ways around it as I am not stopping.

 

[iamdlewis]

I suspect that you have more than a sore back given that it was a jarring act that caused you to go from annoying to really bad. If you can get to a physical therapist I would recommend that over anything else at the moment.

There is only so much you can do for your back. I would highly suggest that you stretch and use a foam roller nightly. You can setup a 15 min routine, this will not cure you but it will help. When I am on birding trips and spend 6-10 hours a day out I find this helps a lot.

 

[Landshark99]

As one gets older and things start to breakdown, you have to make adjustments. Luckely for me my back is good, because for the last 30 years of my career, I had a crew that carried all the equipment on my shoots. I eventually paid the price though of all those years standing, kneeling, squatting and ladder climbing with two knee replacements and now may need a hip one as well. So all one can do is make the best of it, I now shoot far more landscapes from my Jeep than I do hiking into the wild. Hang in there, even if these bird photo hunts are hard on you there are always so many things one can find to shoot that may be easier to accommodate with an uncomfortable back.

 

[Ralph]

Just for a better insight into this I done my back in at August 1992 and I have have 3 operations on this section and they will no longer touch me.
After each operation I had from 3 to 6 weeks of what I know to be good yes there was healing pain but I knew the difference and I was happy. Then I felt the pains of old return, and this was no fun. Then the doctor600 miles away called to tell me I needed another operation. Down I flew and the same story each time.
Then as I call it the domino effect happened. The next body part failed. To add to a full body of Arthritis which tells me far better than the weatherman when we are getting rain. But I got a full left knee replacement. But on this the main artery that goes down to the foot was welded in place and this turned into an emergency operation. For 2 days I was not allowed to move as I had not pulse to my foot for 2 days and put me behind in the knee replacement. And to this day the thing will just collapse on me so most times I need a walking stick. But it gets in the way birding so I risk it without one.
Each day I wake up in pain and go to bed the same way with a rate of 8 though to 10.
I have tried more than I can remember and because the nerves are shot there isn't things that make it better. But what does when I am on a good day I will start birding and my mind is zoned in on them and I can forget about them pain for a good while but even in the end the pain will take over.
Oh I did for get I have had to have my shoulders cleaned out of calcium 5 time between both of them and my left wrist which has been broken 5 times know of and I think another 3 to 4 times as I know up at the hospital due to my age they say just live with it and tell you no more. but you know in yourself the truth as like last week when I broke it again I was told to just take it easy.
So basically this is my story of pain and why I do miss out on a lot of birds, But its my life living with pain while trying to be a semi decent photographer.

 

[Deleted Member 5045]

Hectic story Ralph. Even if there isn't much that can be done, even the toughest still need to pour their heart out sometimes mate. It's impossible to wear a smile 100% of the time.

Non pharmaceutical anti inflammatory stuff would be a good way to go though. Lots of vitamin C, Magnesium, Glucosamine, Circumin, Tumeric, Coriander seed, Hemp seed oil. I actually make a big powder mix up with about 15 different ingredients which I take everyday which includes a lot of joint support and anti inflammatory. A lifetime of motocross and mtb has given me three knee reconstructions amongst 20 or so other broken bones and decent injuries. Amazingly, my body at this point is as good as it was in my early twenties. Always stay away from pharmaceutical drugs, they only band aid the actual problem then cause other problems on top of it.

 

[Uncle Kevriano]

Fighting against my knee and shin splint pains are a constant for me, not just when shooting photos, but the one thing I am prevented from doing is getting down low to take shots as I can't bend my legs enough, and shooting macro, unless it's above waist high, is a big no as well. I will get new knee joints eventually (on the waiting list), and hopefully I will get back to being more mobile.
As for the solution to pain in the meantime... Aside from the Tramadol I am on, which are necessary, I take Turmeric, Glaucosomine/Chindrotin, Zinc, Multivits and Cod Liver supplements, and a couple of Ibuprofen a day.
Ultimately though, age is a bugger and I am constantly frustrated by feeling 20 years older than I am, and 90 years older than my mental age

 

[iain clyne]

I think we are all falling apart. I was invalided out of the Ambulance service with a permeant back injury. That was 27 years ago. I learned to fight against the pain controlling it with pain killers and did 25+ years as a professional sports photographer.
I learned to adapt ways of working, you may not think its possible but it is and with those ways you get by.

 

[Brownie]

@Aussie, have you considered one of those lightweight pop-up blinds (hide) and a light folding chair? It doesn't help to get you to your spot, but you can see an awful lot of birds and creatures sitting quietly while the others move around in the distance. It might give you some relief for shooting. Another trick is to set the camera at eye-height (while seated) on a monopod so you don't have to hold it at the ready for long periods. Good luck, hope you find some answers.

 

[Deleted Member 5003]

Hi Ralph if seems you are going through the wars in continuing to follow your passion
and you have my admiration in that regard

Aging is a challenge we all face, and along life's journey , apart from a very lucky small %
Of people who age without major health issues, for most of us it is a question,as we move along
life's journey of how many Medical land mines we step on......

I have no medical background and do not believe in proffering medical solutions, as we all have very
different life experiences and circumstances , but as one of my close relatives is going through the
Challenges of an autoimmune condition and has tried a multitude of so called consultants he has found
A treatment which is not widely known and allowed him to drop his medications.

The treatment is based on the Colimbri Protocol which essentially involves taking high levels of Vit D3 at
the 20 to 50,000 iu level per day. I will not go into detail, but if your medical challenges have an autoimmune
Component such as rhuematoid arthritis etc it might be worth checking with your medic if it can help to relieve
Some of the pain you describe.

 

[Ralph]

Hectic story Ralph. Even if there isn't much that can be done, even the toughest still need to pour their heart out sometimes mate. It's impossible to wear a smile 100% of the time.

Non pharmaceutical anti inflammatory stuff would be a good way to go though. Lots of vitamin C, Magnesium, Glucosamine, Circumin, Tumeric, Coriander seed, Hemp seed oil. I actually make a big powder mix up with about 15 different ingredients which I take everyday which includes a lot of joint support and anti inflammatory. A lifetime of motocross and mtb has given me three knee reconstructions amongst 20 or so other broken bones and decent injuries. Amazingly, my body at this point is as good as it was in my early twenties. Always stay away from pharmaceutical drugs, they only band aid the actual problem then cause other problems on top of it.

Clint I am not to sure on if it was pouring my heart out as much as putting everyone in the full picture so they are not making educated guesses on thing.
My doctor is now after just money and you go to see him for anything other than your usual medication and he slugs you more. Being on a pension money is accounted for and this is makes it hard to take to him abut other stuff. But well before I think it was Covid when you could talk I tries so many things under the book and I will not try to list them but I am sure most of what you have put down I have tries.
While in Tassie We are able to get the Hemp seed oil. Yes I know this isn't real deal stuff. And I will say this did grind the edged off a few corners and let me get to a few place I other wise would not have been able to get to. But over time that stuff stopped working like it said it would do.
As my wife said I need to try the real deal stuff and then this means no driving and I am willing to give that a try for a certain time.
And this is where I stand at the moment. My normal run of the mill medication and it gets me out and this is better than being stuck inside the house all day long like I know I seriously could do and get away with it.

 

[Ralph]

Fighting against my knee and shin splint pains are a constant for me, not just when shooting photos, but the one thing I am prevented from doing is getting down low to take shots as I can't bend my legs enough, and shooting macro, unless it's above waist high, is a big no as well. I will get new knee joints eventually (on the waiting list), and hopefully I will get back to being more mobile.
As for the solution to pain in the meantime... Aside from the Tramadol I am on, which are necessary, I take Turmeric, Glaucosomine/Chindrotin, Zinc, Multivits and Cod Liver supplements, and a couple of Ibuprofen a day.
Ultimately though, age is a bugger and I am constantly frustrated by feeling 20 years older than I am, and 90 years older than my mental age

I know the getting down low thing oh so well. I look like a Giraffe getting up from having a drink of water, so I do my best to avoid those things as much as possible. I know for a fact that Tramadol on make me fell sick and don't touch pain in any way what so ever. As I have mentioned most things that have been said or mentioned here as sometime I have tried and not for the on lot for well over 6 months to make sure I have given them time to get into my system and are working or not working. And in the end I just give u on them as there is no change to anything.

 

[Ralph]

I think we are all falling apart. I was invalided out of the Ambulance service with a permeant back injury. That was 27 years ago. I learned to fight against the pain controlling it with pain killers and did 25+ years as a professional sports photographer.
I learned to adapt ways of working, you may not think its possible but it is and with those ways you get by.

That is the ting what we do as kid we get it back as an adult, well this is how I see it,
I would love to have a system that works for me. But in this I am weird as soon as you think you have got it worked out the posts are moved and then you need to find another strategy to work on the way this one has gone. Many friends have said you have been like this for so long surely you know what to do by now. I wish this was true as one day I can go lets birding and it is a good day the next time you go out and you find everything you do just adds to pain. So I never know where I stand from day to day. I do wish it wasn't thins way and then life would be far easier but its the way it is with me and I just do what I can do on that particular day.

 

[Ralph]

@Aussie, have you considered one of those lightweight pop-up blinds (hide) and a light folding chair? It doesn't help to get you to your spot, but you can see an awful lot of birds and creatures sitting quietly while the others move around in the distance. It might give you some relief for shooting. Another trick is to set the camera at eye-height (while seated) on a monopod so you don't have to hold it at the ready for long periods. Good luck, hope you find some answers.

What you have mentioned I have actually found a site here in Australia that sell and make these and I am going to look into them and I see their merit.
But not for our summers here as they are just far too hot and yes I will have to change my way of going about things but I think this could very will be the way for me to move along in the future. So a good suggestion.

 

[Ralph]

Hi Ralph if seems you are going through the wars in continuing to follow your passion
and you have my admiration in that regard

Aging is a challenge we all face, and along life's journey , apart from a very lucky small %
Of people who age without major health issues, for most of us it is a question,as we move along
life's journey of how many Medical land mines we step on......

I have no medical background and do not believe in proffering medical solutions, as we all have very
different life experiences and circumstances , but as one of my close relatives is going through the
Challenges of an autoimmune condition and has tried a multitude of so called consultants he has found
A treatment which is not widely known and allowed him to drop his medications.

The treatment is based on the Colimbri Protocol which essentially involves taking high levels of Vit D3 at
the 20 to 50,000 iu level per day. I will not go into detail, but if your medical challenges have an autoimmune
Component such as rhuematoid arthritis etc it might be worth checking with your medic if it can help to relieve
Some of the pain you describe.

Thanks for your reply and let me first say please let your relative I send him best and hope that he his doing a well as can be expected.
I my life this is what I have been dealt and I never started this to have a life on it own. I don't to show how pain affect my ability to get shots on my bad days. On my good days I am as good as the rest of my group.
So it really is just as i said to show that at times I miss easy t get shots as I just can't move as quick and my pains are on my mind and body that slow me down to the extent what I think I said the last outing I got only 9 birds while my offside got 31 or so.
As I have mentioned in these other replies I have tries so many different thing and I am not saying for one minute that I have tried them all.
But there does come a time or with me there does where I say enough is enough and may times what you are given but not all the side effects can be far worse than the cure. And I just get to a point where I say no more of this or that and just try to cope as best I can with my doctors medication. Though this at times seem to do very little as well. But I will keep plugging on the best I can and just say others out there are far worse. I can still walk and get out into the fresh air on my own and they cant so I am better off than many others.

 

[Gaz]

I’m not in that situation yet, but all the youthful injuries have developed arthritis so I’ve got niggling reminders that I’m no longer 25, and at least 10 medical specialists whose children must appreciate me for my dedication to a healthy recovery.

Medicinal Mary Jane?

Micro dosing magic mushrooms?

A really fast mobility scooter with gimbles attached to an automated swiveling seat to which I’m harnessed (it’s on the drawing board, trust me - I just watched “the edge of tomorrow” and those soldiers swinging out of a helicopter strapped to a machine gun has given me ideas) - apparatus linked directly to autofocus tracking on the Sony A1vx. Bonus back stretch.

-shorter bus trips in a limo instead of a bus… etc.

 

[Deleted Member 5045]

Clint I am not to sure on if it was pouring my heart out as much as putting everyone in the full picture so they are not making educated guesses on thing.
My doctor is now after just money and you go to see him for anything other than your usual medication and he slugs you more. Being on a pension money is accounted for and this is makes it hard to take to him abut other stuff. But well before I think it was Covid when you could talk I tries so many things under the book and I will not try to list them but I am sure most of what you have put down I have tries.
While in Tassie We are able to get the Hemp seed oil. Yes I know this isn't real deal stuff. And I will say this did grind the edged off a few corners and let me get to a few place I other wise would not have been able to get to. But over time that stuff stopped working like it said it would do.
As my wife said I need to try the real deal stuff and then this means no driving and I am willing to give that a try for a certain time.
And this is where I stand at the moment. My normal run of the mill medication and it gets me out and this is better than being stuck inside the house all day long like I know I seriously could do and get away with it.

You're referring to CBD cannabis oil, this is what I'd get anyone to use in my family if they got cancer. No one has had cancer in my family so we're looking good right now, but my whole family is the same as myself where we are all basically anti establishment, so anti anything that is of relation to the government, and we all know better than to take their poisonous substances anyway.

The reason marijuana was so attacked over the years is that it is basically put here for the good health of humans. If it was utilised correctly along with proper nutritional and lifestyle knowledge, the medical system would basically be entirely useless. Chemotherapy destroys all cells resulting in a downwards domino effect in the body, if I remember it's something like 88% of people who receive chemotherapy end up having some type of neurological issue within 5 years. Cannabis oil only attacks cancerous cells and leaves the healthy cells intact.

The other thing I was going to suggest as Gaz has mentioned is to micro dose magic mushrooms. Much like cannabis oil it can reconnect broken pathways in the body. I have a good mate who done this to great success for an issue with his wife, not to mention a win win because he learnt how to grow them himself so I'm able to grab them off him when I want them.

When it comes to health or anything for that matter, basically start by looking into the opposite of what the government recommends and this will be pretty close to where you want to be. ️They do not make money or gain more control by having healthy, self reliant, free thinking citizens roaming about. ️

 

[Ralph]

I’m not in that situation yet, but all the youthful injuries have developed arthritis so I’ve got niggling reminders that I’m no longer 25, and at least 10 medical specialists whose children must appreciate me for my dedication to a healthy recovery.

Medicinal Mary Jane?

Micro dosing magic mushrooms?

A really fast mobility scooter with gimbles attached to an automated swiveling seat to which I’m harnessed (it’s on the drawing board, trust me - I just watched “the edge of tomorrow” and those soldiers swinging out of a helicopter strapped to a machine gun has given me ideas) - apparatus linked directly to autofocus tracking on the Sony A1vx. Bonus back stretch.

-shorter bus trips in a limo instead of a bus… etc.

I have worked out things for me to get out and take photo's like I now have got my camera able to attach to my backpack so there is not need to have so many straps around your neck. And believe me it has made it easier to walk about hands free and the camera is not moving around so far as if it was on the old strap. Which by the way I can put it back on to that if I want to.
It took me a couple of weeks to get use to it, as yes it did pull on other back muscle but now it I all good. And I can on a good day go for a good few hours with it like this.
I drink a lot of water and due to the way my shoulders are I just can't reach back to get my water out of the pocket on the back back. I found some part of an older bag I use to own but I cut parts off and this goes around my waist with 2 pockets sewn on to it and one for water and one for my phone.extra batteries. And this adds no pressure to any part of me. I call it my Batman belt. And this has helped. The other thing I made was a staff but I found when you need it you are to tired to use it right so I think these are over raters but I put a sling on it so I can just drop it take my photo's and them cause it is attached to my wrist I pull it back up and off I go again.

 

[Ralph]

You're referring to CBD cannabis oil, this is what I'd get anyone to use in my family if they got cancer. No one has had cancer in my family so we're looking good right now, but my whole family is the same as myself where we are all basically anti establishment, so anti anything that is of relation to the government, and we all know better than to take their poisonous substances anyway.

The reason marijuana was so attacked over the years is that it is basically put here for the good health of humans. If it was utilised correctly along with proper nutritional and lifestyle knowledge, the medical system would basically be entirely useless. Chemotherapy destroys all cells resulting in a downwards domino effect in the body, if I remember it's something like 88% of people who receive chemotherapy end up having some type of neurological issue within 5 years. Cannabis oil only attacks cancerous cells and leaves the healthy cells intact.

The other thing I was going to suggest as Gaz has mentioned is to micro dose magic mushrooms. Much like cannabis oil it can reconnect broken pathways in the body. I have a good mate who done this to great success for an issue with his wife, not to mention a win win because he learnt how to grow them himself so I'm able to grab them off him when I want them.

When it comes to health or anything for that matter, basically start by looking into the opposite of what the government recommends and this will be pretty close to where you want to be. ️They do not make money or gain more control by having healthy, self reliant, free thinking citizens roaming about. ️

Unlike you Clint I am opposite and in this I am not the best at reading and what I do read many time I don't understand what they are on about. My wife reads 99% of legal documents that come to the house I just sign. Not because I am lazy but I just don't understand it once I have read it. And this doen't make me ignorant either. So on what you have said I will take your word for it.
I don't like Mushrooms magic or normal. So on them I will give them a pass. When we can get the full grade Marijuana that they have proven works and I know I will not be driving for a while I will use that and this is the only thing I am willing to get a try over all other things, as I feel this is what will work on me the best.

 

[Deleted Member 5003]

Thanks for your reply and let me first say please let your relative I send him best and hope that he his doing a well as can be expected.
I my life this is what I have been dealt and I never started this to have a life on it own. I don't to show how pain affect my ability to get shots on my bad days. On my good days I am as good as the rest of my group.
So it really is just as i said to show that at times I miss easy t get shots as I just can't move as quick and my pains are on my mind and body that slow me down to the extent what I think I said the last outing I got only 9 birds while my offside got 31 or so.
As I have mentioned in these other replies I have tries so many different thing and I am not saying for one minute that I have tried them all.
But there does come a time or with me there does where I say enough is enough and may times what you are given but not all the side effects can be far worse than the cure. And I just get to a point where I say no more of this or that and just try to cope as best I can with my doctors medication. Though this at times seem to do very little as well. But I will keep plugging on the best I can and just say others out there are far worse. I can still walk and get out into the fresh air on my own and they cant so I am better off than many others.

I wish you all the best going forward Ralph......yes there are so many more out there that are worse off than we can ever imagine.

 

[Rick Dahms]

I had the same problem, Ralph. Not so much anymore...
This is something ridiculously simple that I got from a German physical therapist that really turned things around:
Every time you stand up, from sitting or laying down, blow out, like you're blowing out a stick match. Blow out through the entire move until you're standing. Do it every time you stand up. It seems like such a minor thing but after more than a decade of chronic back problems, this worked. It'll strengthen your core and take some of the load off your spine.

Get a good back brace and at the first sign of trouble put it on. Wear it to bed. I didn't want to wear it on a shoot so I would take it off when I went to work and put it on after everyone had gone. But wearing it to bed, all night, really sped up the recovery time. Spend some money, it has to be comfortable enough to sleep in but sturdy enough to keep you from twisting in your sleep.

For pain relief, I used DMSO with a topical analgesic. My favorite was Sombra but Voltaren, Aspercreme, Arnicare... all work. Rub the analgesic in over the pain, then take about a teaspoon of DMSO in your palm and rub that in on top of it. It's a solvent and it carries the analgesic through the skin. Really great for joint pain, too.

Good luck and let us know how it goes.

 

[Ralph]

Thanks for that Rick. What I will say straight away mine is just not the getting old or degeneration of the back.
I have had operations on it and wore braces which in the long run did sort of work but I wanted to be be be more independent and not rely on any sort of brace to be upright.
So I struggled along and let the back muscle work more and I have got to a stage where. I am at the stage where what most can say on what to do I have tried used or tried and got to points where these just stop working. I tried Shark cartledge and going by what was said these were the mirical for people like me but no one and I really do mean this part what works for one may not work one little bit on the next.
Doctors try this thing as I call it the LIST and they follow this list of what to do and because we all are different some parts of their list don't work and I told them just this. To be told by them that is it the tried and tested way. So I just told them stop treating everyone as the same person and then you might get better results. This want down like a rock in a pond.
What I have found my first half to an hour of birding I can have quite a relatively pain freeish time. But once the pain does work its way back in. Well then you are back at square one. I wish I knew how to fix it, but as it stands I need to have the next few levels operated on or even to the fact fusing the full back might be the trick for me.
But I will give the blow out thing a try all the same, Who knows as simple as it is this could be what works and thanks so much for that.

 

[Rick Dahms]

I hear ya and man I empathize. You never know what will work. The blow thing worked for me but my problem, after 15 years of repeated injury was weakness and it addressed that. And I was shocked that it helped at all. And, like us, doctors are all different. I must have burned 40 of them before anyone mentioned blowing when standing up. Keep turning over those rocks. Sooner or later someone will cough up an answer that works.

 

[Ralph]

I hear ya and man I empathize. You never know what will work. The blow thing worked for me but my problem, after 15 years of repeated injury was weakness and it addressed that. And I was shocked that it helped at all. And, like us, doctors are all different. I must have burned 40 of them before anyone mentioned blowing when standing up. Keep turning over those rocks. Sooner or later someone will cough up an answer that works.

That is the wish and as I said the best one so far though only short is when I am out birding.
But I have got massive nerve damage and when I got operated on the Mr. as he was higher than a doctor said it was one of the worse damaged backs he has seen.
But in all honesty I have been and done a lot as jumping through hoops to please doctors and not one thing has works and and you do become very cynical when these so call experts come up with things and all they have just got book knowledge.

 

[Tinopener]

Sorry to hear about your back I was told that the back was one of the hardest problems to fathom as it is so complicated and people use it as an excuse to swing the lead ..... Now that's out of the way what gear you selling .... No only joshing after spending years out in the rain .. Swinging a sledge hammer .. Taking down buildings digging out foundations my old back and shoulders are shot .. Bone on bone and the noise they make when doing some things well its frightening was stroking the dog and a mate thought the boiler was going to explode .. Hope your better soon ... Gary

 

[Slug]

I had the same problem, Ralph. Not so much anymore...
This is something ridiculously simple that I got from a German physical therapist that really turned things around:
Every time you stand up, from sitting or laying down, blow out, like you're blowing out a stick match. Blow out through the entire move until you're standing. Do it every time you stand up. It seems like such a minor thing but after more than a decade of chronic back problems, this worked. It'll strengthen your core and take some of the load off your spine.

Get a good back brace and at the first sign of trouble put it on. Wear it to bed. I didn't want to wear it on a shoot so I would take it off when I went to work and put it on after everyone had gone. But wearing it to bed, all night, really sped up the recovery time. Spend some money, it has to be comfortable enough to sleep in but sturdy enough to keep you from twisting in your sleep.

For pain relief, I used DMSO with a topical analgesic. My favorite was Sombra but Voltaren, Aspercreme, Arnicare... all work. Rub the analgesic in over the pain, then take about a teaspoon of DMSO in your palm and rub that in on top of it. It's a solvent and it carries the analgesic through the skin. Really great for joint pain, too.

Good luck and let us know how it goes.

Best advice! Back brace is good short term relief, core exercise the best long term. (I worked as a Remedial massage therapist and found this effective)